ep. 75 - Ridgely Goldsborough


Author and International Speaker, Ridgely Goldsborough, believes in taking complex and challenging topics and making sense out of them. He started his first business at the age of 16 and after graduating from Law School in 1987 has started a total 43 companies. For one of those businesses, he founded Domain Street Magazine, the very first internet based magazine about the domain name industry.

Ridgely and his team have over 400 active websites in multiple business verticals and he speaks around the world, in both English and Spanish, as one of the foremost experts in internet marketing, with a specific emphasis on cause-based marketing. He has written 12 books, hosted his own television show and created dozens of audio and video programs on success and prosperity, and conducted dozens of online marketing campaigns resulting in millions of dollars in sales.

In addition, Ridgely is the co-founder of the WHY Engine, and KnowYourWHY.com the revolutionary marketing and messaging program used by professionals world wide to attract ideal clients based on the company’s WHY. He is a frequent speaker at the top internet marketing conferences and acts as a facilitator and trainer for high-level masterminds for CEOs and CEO retreats.


ep. 75 - Ridgely Goldsborough

Kyle Davis: All right, so with us today on GDA Podcast, we have Ridgely Goldsborough. And when I do these podcasts by myself, I don't really like reading a scripted introduction, so with that being said, Ridgely, give it away.

Ridgely Goldsborough: Well ...

Kyle Davis: Or take it away. Or something like [00:01:00] that. How are you?

Ridgely Goldsborough: Oh thanks, Kyle. I'm great. Thanks so much for having me on, I'm really excited to spend some time with you, speaking about all the sorts of things that are of great interest to hopefully all the listeners that are out there.

Kyle Davis: Well, we have a decent amount. Growing month over month. You know? Whatever. So, anyways, with that being said though, I know that you've done a lot of work with GDA. Both in speaking engagements and then also here with our team. [00:01:30] If you can though, and we'll hit on this and this preamble will make sense a little bit later.

If you can, can you give people your background from you as a little young'un to where you are today? And then we'll go from there.

Ridgely Goldsborough: So, interestingly I've been a serial entrepreneur since forever. Started 43 companies, and basically what that means is two or three of them were successful, four or five were moderately successful, and the rest represented a tremendous education.

[00:02:00] And that's largely because of being psychologically unemployable. Not fitting the norm. I've had one job my entire career for approximately 30 days, that did not last. It was a client of my dad's. I was a pest-control guy, at the age of 18. That did not really work for me.

And so, I went on to figure out that it doesn't make a lot of sense to me to be building someone else's dreams, and what can I do about that? And from there, it went into let's write about this, let's speak about this. And now it's 15 books later. And elated [00:02:30] to be able to share concepts that have come up, and popped up, and make sense to me.

Such as, who are you? What do you believe? And what does that mean?

Kyle Davis: So, to tie that into what you just said. Who are you? Clearly, if you've started 43 companies, you're a serial entrepreneur. But, what is it that gives you the itch to say, "Hey, I see a problem, uh, you know, let's start something to solve it." Or what are you focusing on that gives you this [00:03:00] interest to go start a company, whether it's successful or not?

Ridgely Goldsborough: So, I have this motto. This theory that it is much better to be first than smart. In other words, if you see something ahead of the marketplace, and you can see that there's a void, a gap, a solution that you can provide that's not out there. If you can jump in there quickly, then you don't have to be as unbelievably great at the details, and the nuances, and the commodity pricing that kicks in over time [00:03:30] with any product or service.

So, for me it's always been about let's make sure we're first, and then try to surround ourselves with smart people. But then, I don't have to rely on being the smartest guy to be successful, I just have to be the pioneer.

Kyle Davis: Mm-hmm (affirmative)

Ridgely Goldsborough: And of course the pioneers take a lot of arrows, and we take a lot of flack, and we make mistakes. And we do crazy things. And that's okay, because the other parts make up for it. And it's always exciting. It's always new.

For me, as soon as things are up and running, and smoothly humming [00:04:00] along, or whatever, suddenly it's not that interesting. Now, I'm like, "Wait, where's the next challenge? What's the next thing around the bend?"

Kyle Davis: Mm-hmm (affirmative) So, I kind of like what you just said, and I'd like to maybe expand on it just a little bit. You said, "It's much better to be first than smart."

Ridgely Goldsborough: Right.

Kyle Davis: And I understand what you're saying by that but, maybe let me paraphrase and then we can expand on it just a little bit. But you're saying that once you see an opportunity, or see an opening, that maybe other people in [00:04:30] the industry are overlooking. If you're first to market, you're allowed to make all the mistakes. But at the end of the day, you're still first to market.

And then you can figure the details out later.

Ridgely Goldsborough: That's exactly right. If you get in there first, there's going to be a curve. There's going to be early adopters. The early adopters are going to turn into the early majority. And if you can get there early enough, and stick around, then you're going to capture a big chunk. Leaving everyone else to kind of fight for the rest.

A lot of times, you're going to put yourself in a position where somebody says, "You know what? I think [00:05:00] I can run what you started better than you can. And therefore, I'd like to buy that from you."

Kyle Davis: Mm-hmm (affirmative)

Ridgely Goldsborough: Okay, fine. You can move on to the next one. Where can I be first again? What else is out there? Especially, in today's digital world. Where business does indeed, as Bill Gates said, "Operate at the speed of thought."

Well, you can come up with things. And if you read the book Lean Startup, you can fail quickly. Fail forward very fast.

Kyle Davis: Mm-hmm (affirmative)

Ridgely Goldsborough: Make adoption, make moments. Think of yourself as a jet ski, not a super tanker. [00:05:30] And make a pivot. And then make another pivot. And then make another pivot. And suddenly gain a little bit of traction, and you're like, "Wow, look at what we just created. It came out of nowhere. And suddenly, we have this community. And it has 100,000 people in it, and these 100,000 people need all these different things that we can provide for them." And then you can roll from there. I just think it is a lot easier to be first than smart.

Kyle Davis: Well, I couldn't agree with you more about failing fast, failing forward, pivot, pivot, pivot. I mean, that has been the mantra instilled in me in my startup [00:06:00] career.

Ridgely Goldsborough: Mm-hmm (affirmative)

Kyle Davis: In San Francisco and New York and it's just, to me, it's fascinating, and I pick on people, or pick on ... Discusses. I talk about these legacy companies versus these startups. And how that mentality isn't there, where you don't know if something's going to work, and the only thing that you can do is just try it.

And then you set a benchmark, and either you hit it or you don't, and if you don't hit it, then you take what you learned and you pivot.

Ridgely Goldsborough: That's right.

Kyle Davis: That's what you do.

Ridgely Goldsborough: That's exactly right. And if you think about the difference in, for example, [00:06:30] how Steve Jobs used to approach things. He was not into focus groups. He was like, "No, we've got something. Let's put it out there. Let's listen to the marketplace. Let's gain feedback, and let's move, and move, and move, and move, and move."

And that's what I love to do. I love surveys, I love talking to the public. I love taking a video, putting it on YouTube, getting it out there to a demographic and saying, "What do you think about this?" Involving them in the process. Feeling like there's almost a co-creation with the marketplace going on. And in that way, creating a tribe, [00:07:00] if you will, that are willing to follow what you do. And by consequence are interested in what you have to offer.

Kyle Davis: Yeah, I've seen this work in two very different ways. But, I'm not gonna name the companies, but I will say that they're in the same industry. And one is extremely design focused, and the other is very much focused on delivering as quickly as possible, any request from any customer. And while they both sound brilliant, like, [00:07:30] ideas into going to market, I will say that the design-focused one, while they listen to the customers, and they really do talk, the execution tends to be better. The user interface tends to be cleaner. It just is more intuitive. Versus having this, like, design-by-committee, quickly rushing out, pumping out.

Ridgely Goldsborough: Mm-hmm (affirmative)

Kyle Davis: And there has to be a healthy mix. Don't you agree on that one?

Ridgely Goldsborough: For sure. For me, if there's one thing that is very helpful [00:08:00] in putting a product out there, it's, "What is the user experience?" And to make sure that we never forget that it's always about T-H-E-M. It's always about them, it's not about me. It's about them. It's always about them. It's always about the user, it's about the person who is landing on your website, who is using your product for the first time. What do they need? What is gonna benefit them in some way?

What answer are we providing to a question that they have that is causing them some level of pain, angst, or they have [00:08:30] some kind of a need? And if, to the extent that we can stay focused in that way, and not get caught up in, "Oh, I've got another great idea." Or, "How smart am I?" Or, "What genius thing came across our plate?" No, no, no, no, no.

What are you doing? Who are you providing a value to? What is that service or product? And how can you focus on what they need? So, that you continue to improve that every step of the way.

Kyle Davis: Fair enough. I like that. Now, you've mentioned earlier that you have 15 books. Another one we discussed prior to recording [00:09:00] that you have a new one coming out.

Ridgely Goldsborough: Yeah.

Kyle Davis: And it's called Wealth Kryptonite.

Ridgely Goldsborough: Yes.

Kyle Davis: What's the spiel on this?

Ridgely Goldsborough: So, it was very interesting. I co-wrote this book with the owner of Peachtree Capital, who is a big wealth management firm in Atlanta, Georgia. And it came about because he said the following to me. He said, "Do you realize that financial advisors and registered investment advisors are basically shrinks?" And I said, "No, I had no idea they were shrinks."

He said, "Well, if you ... When it comes [00:09:30] to money, the rules are always the same. If you do A, B, C, D, and E, you accumulate wealth. If you don't, you never will. It's just that simple. Those rules don't change. So the only thing that changes is people's relationship to money. And a financial advisor's main job is to keep the relationship with money intact, on track, in the right, uh, place so that they do what they need to do to accumulate the wealth that they say they want."

And he says to me, "So, you, [00:10:00] you do all this work on avatars. On people's avatars, and understanding their strengths and weaknesses, which we call superpowers and kryptonites. If I as a financial management company knew the avatar of my clients, I could help them stay in the right relationship with money. It would give us a super huge edge over everybody else in the financial-services world. You want to write a book?"

And I said, "Yeah. So you're saying you want to marry my avatar technology [00:10:30] along with financial services and the relationship that people have with money." And he said, "Yes, that's exactly what I want to do. It makes complete sense to me and it would be a big, big game changer, a disruptive approach to wealth management."

And I said, "You know what? That sounds super interesting. Let's do it."

So, Wealth Kryptonite is about, "What is your weakness? What is your kryptonite that is keeping you away from that wealth, and how can you get back to playing to your superpower, and accumulating that?"

Kyle Davis: What weaknesses, [00:11:00] generally speaking, do you see that are kinda the pitfalls of people in their attempt to acquire wealth?

Ridgely Goldsborough: So, it depends on their avatar. So, for example let's take avatar number one, which is the giver. The giver is the person who wants to make a different, add value, contribute, have an impact in the world. The challenge is they also want to give it away. So, obviously, if the giver doesn't have somebody that can help them say, "No." Then, they may make money, but it's gonna end up [00:11:30] flowing right out the other end.

Kyle Davis: Mm-hmm (affirmative)

Ridgely Goldsborough: So, it completely depends on what the avatar is of each individual, in terms of what is going to be their kryptonite? And there are seven different avatars.

Kyle Davis: So, based off of what it is, you'll then come up with a solution for the financial advisor to then better approach a situation, and coach the individual into what direction they should go, so they can better monopolize a return or I'm trying [00:12:00] to speak in this jargon so you know what I'm talking about.

Ridgely Goldsborough: Correct.

Kyle Davis: But, so it's like one of those, it's that simple then.

Ridgely Goldsborough: Well, what you said is exactly correct, and much more.

Kyle Davis: Mm-hmm (affirmative)

Ridgely Goldsborough: Because imagine now, Kyle, you're married, and you have a spouse. And they have an avatar that is different than yours. Well, the financial advisor needs to understand not only your avatar, but her avatar, and how the two go together, in order to help you jointly as a couple make the right decisions.

Kyle Davis: Mm-hmm (affirmative)

Ridgely Goldsborough: [00:12:30] So, it's not only understanding the individual, it's understanding their dynamic, their family relationship. How all that fits together, that then gives a financial advisor a huge edge in the marketplace, in terms of really helping a client.

Kyle Davis: Oh wow. So, what we've discussed prior to this, and we thought it would be kind of a fun idea, is to figure out what my avatar is. So, I think this would be a good time for us to segue into do a live version of this. I've never [00:13:00] seen this. I've never done it. And we're gonna do it live, as they say.

Ridgely Goldsborough: Fantastic, let's do it.

Kyle Davis: So, let's figure me out, because I know my mom would like to know that.

Ridgely Goldsborough: Well, not only that, I'm gonna raise the bar on myself. Just to make it kinda fun.

Kyle Davis: Cool.

Ridgely Goldsborough: So what I'm gonna do is I'm gonna ask you to tell me a couple of stories. And I'm gonna tell you right now, ahead of time, for everybody to hear. You're going to tell me the same story twice.

Kyle Davis: Okay.

Ridgely Goldsborough: Even though I'm telling you ahead of time that's gonna [00:13:30] happen. It's gonna happen anyway. And the reason why that works is because brain biology never changes. Biology is 100 percent effective. When you're freezing, you want to warm up. When you're starving hungry, you want to eat. Every single time. So, if I focus on taking you through these exercises. Based on brain biology, we're gonna come to the same basic conclusion from both. Cool?

Kyle Davis: Cool.

Ridgely Goldsborough: All right. Let's do it. So tell me about something that happened to you at work with another human being. A specific interaction [00:14:00] that you had with somebody else, that made you feel successful or great.

Kyle Davis: So now I'm having to rack my brain real quick. This is back when I was working in San Francisco for a startup and we were developing ... We were coming into an issue on the enterprise-side of having too long of a sales cycle for a very low [00:14:30] margin solution that we were selling. And what we've realized, and this is in talking with another account executive, is that we needed somebody that during the sales process would develop the solution in realtime as the prospective client was watching.

And so, we kinda came to this solution, or this idea, together. And then it was my responsibility to execute on that. So, [00:15:00] when we went into the first call, and we were doing this screen-share and I was just showing ... You know, he was kinda going through the demo, and I was building the client's wishlist in realtime. And they were watching me do it to see how simplistic it was.

And what we've then mastered over a few iterations of that, was the ability to basically shorten the sales cycle down to, I think, 25 percent of what it once was.

Ridgely Goldsborough: [00:15:30] Nice.

Kyle Davis: Yeah. Not bad. And it also got much more buy-in, so instead of doing a proof-of-concept, instead we rolled out to every location versus just doing a one-location, then having a year or a year-and-a-half long rollout. So, it really helped us, because we were able to build to the client's specifications and show them, you know, necessarily what we could do ... Not necessarily what we could do. We showed them what we could do, which [00:16:00] necessitated the reason for them to have to purchase from us.

Ridgely Goldsborough: Okay. Perfect. So, do me a favor. Talk in terms of I, because it's your avatar we're talking about.

Kyle Davis: I. All right. I.

Ridgely Goldsborough: And tell me what about that made you feel successful?

Kyle Davis: Well, it made me feel successful because one, I was delivering beyond the expectations of the client. The client, if the roles were revered, I'm sure they've been pitched a million times, you know, something where the pitch deck was [00:16:30] changed. They had a conversation. The other vendors probably came to them. And then after a call, they did some tinkering and brought them back something recycled.

Instead what I did was that I worked to customize to their exacting expectations down to how many clicks, what the workflow was like, how fast they can get from one thing to another. And I made it so that they couldn't say no.

Ridgely Goldsborough: [00:17:00] Right.

Kyle Davis: Because they were so impressed because of it. And that's what made me feel successful.

Ridgely Goldsborough: Okay. So, that's kinda what you did. What I'm looking for is what about it made you feel successful.

Kyle Davis: Well, because of that. I mean I know that's what I did. What I did? Or what? I guess what I did was I impressed the clients, which then made me feel successful.

Ridgely Goldsborough: Sure.

Kyle Davis: It's kind of like a tricky way of getting to my own ego there. But yeah. [00:17:30] That's what it was. It was the ability for me to just showcase, you know, how smart and simple the idea was.

Ridgely Goldsborough: Yeah. And why was that important to you?

Kyle Davis: It was important to me because it's what we promised. It was in the mantra of the company that we worked for. And I delivered and exceeded that. And by doing both of those, I felt successful.

Ridgely Goldsborough: Okay. Perfect. [00:18:00] Switch gears. Forget about work. And share with me a second story that has nothing to do with work. Can be friends, family, relationships, health, an adventure, a hobby, anything you want. Something that happened with another person, again, a specific interaction with somebody else outside work that made you feel successful or great.

Kyle Davis: Oh gosh, this is probably where I need to be a nicer person to people. You know, I think ... [00:18:30] Outside of work. So, I have a friend of mine, we're not so close anymore, but at the time we were very close. And, I value relationships and loyalty is something that's ... Not loyalty in the sense that, like mob-style loyalty, not that. Where you're beholden to somebody else. But, genuine loyalty and respect for somebody is something that's hugely important for me.

So, I had this very dear friend of mine and she just [00:19:00] all of a sudden had a seizure on a subway, and just wasn't herself. And she got checked into the hospital. And it wasn't until a couple hours later that I found out, and I was the only person aside from another friend of ours, that were really with her during this process while she was in the hospital.

There was a heatwave going through New York City. She was lost in the ER, because they had to do some shuffling of the chairs on the deck, [00:19:30] so to speak. And so she was lost. And we noticed, her and I, that, "Hey, no one's kind of helping out." And she's starting to get stressed from that.

And so, I was able to track down the team that was able to maneuver her out of, what is essentially a waiting room with everybody else, into an individual room, where they ran a number of tests on her. And I was with her during the process when she got her diagnosis for MS and I was holding her hand. And [00:20:00] you know, the thing about it that came from me and what made me feel successful is that I was there for a friend in the time of need. And she knew it, I knew it. And to me that felt like I had a successful friendship and relationship at that time.

And that was the thing that kinda most mattered to me. And from there, countless visits, any time she needed anything, she could pick up the phone and call me. And I'd go help her out. Heck, I [00:20:30] moved back from San Francisco to New York to go help take care of her. So, you know, I was really trying to be the best friend I possibly could be for this person that I really respected and admired and loved very deeply as a friend.

So, I felt successful [crosstalk 00:20:46]

Ridgely Goldsborough: And why was that important to you? I can hear that, so why was that important to you?

Kyle Davis: It was important to me because I feel kind of in a number of ways. One, I mean, if this is your friend, regardless of what the relationship [00:21:00] is, I mean, that's what you should be doing. That's what we should be doing as individuals, and as people. But more importantly. Not more importantly, but I guess a secondary part of it, is I do believe in karma. I think if you put some good out there in the world, some good is gonna come back onto you.

So, that was important to me. And just being a good friend when someone else really needed a friend. And they didn't have really many people to turn to.

Ridgely Goldsborough: Sure. So let me ask you a couple of questions.

Kyle Davis: Mm-hmm (affirmative)

Ridgely Goldsborough: [00:21:30] Are you the type of person that finds yourself often asking the question, "What if?" Or, "What about this?" Or, "What about that?" And, "How about this?"

Kyle Davis: Always. I'm always thinking about the secondary, tertiary effects. And so on, and so forth. So, I'm always kind of going through that process.

Ridgely Goldsborough: Exactly. Kind of like when you're building something in realtime versus walking around the hospital in realtime. Trying to figure out what the heck's going on. And how you're gonna get through that. And dah, dah, dah.

Kyle Davis: Correct.

Ridgely Goldsborough: Hear the difference? Hear the similarity, I mean?

Kyle Davis: Yeah.

Ridgely Goldsborough: And do you feel successful when you find ways of improving things, [00:22:00] and tweaking things, and coming up with new approaches?

Kyle Davis: Yes. If you're not growing, you're dying.

Ridgely Goldsborough: That's exactly right. You, my friend, are the innovator. That's what you do. You find better ways of doing things. You constantly are looking for, "How do I tweak this? How do I improve it?" It doesn't even matter whether it's your garage at home, and how do you reorganize it, or a room at home. To an entire manufacturing plant. Or a podcast at GDA, or whatever it may be. "How do we tweak this? How do we improve this? How do we make it better? How do we take it to the next [00:22:30] level?" That's Kyle Davis. The innovator.

Kyle Davis: I would agree on that.

Ridgely Goldsborough: And so, your superpower, your strength is improvements. You are always tweaking. Your mind never stops asking the question, "Well, what about this? And what about that? What if we tried this? And how about this approach? And this could be better."

It's a continuous way of looking at the world that makes you able to really, really find better ways of doing things.

Kyle Davis: Mm-hmm (affirmative)

Ridgely Goldsborough: Now, [00:23:00] you ready for your kryptonite?

Kyle Davis: Could I guess at it, and then you tell me?

Ridgely Goldsborough: Sure. Of course.

Kyle Davis: My guess is the fact that I'm so incessant at how often I should tell people what they should do to improve. And how much I think something should be done. And I'm a perfectionist in anything that it's kind of like a double-edged sword. So, what's benefit to me is also my kryptonite. And I have to focus on how I approach people. That might be right?

Ridgely Goldsborough: Very, very close. Absolutely.

Kyle Davis: Okay.

Ridgely Goldsborough: What we say is, " [00:23:30] It's in essence, the thing you gotta be aware of is change for change's sake." Because a lot of times, there's a system in place.

Kyle Davis: Mm-hmm (affirmative)

Ridgely Goldsborough: And it is good enough. And the system leads to stability. And you see it, and you say, "Well, you know, this could be better. I don't care whether it's the process by which GDA goes about making a selection of a speaker." Whatever it may be. You can see it, because you have that inquisitive, innovative mind. You can see it, but a lot of times people don't want to hear, "Hey, what about this?" [00:24:00] If it's on their watch. And they've already figured it out. So change for change's sake is something that you have to watch out for, because you can't help yourself from wanting to improve things, because you see how things could be better.

And that's your gift to the world. So, knowing how to communicate is exactly on point, to your point. It is the kryptonite, it's that change for change's sake. And where that change upsets the apple cart, upsets the stability of an organization, or a team, that you have to be careful for.

Kyle Davis: [00:24:30] Well, I think you hit the nail on the head on that one.

Ridgely Goldsborough: Well, now imagine. You can sort of parlay that forward into you know the kryptonite, you know the superpower of every single person that you work with.

Kyle Davis: Mm-hmm (affirmative)

Ridgely Goldsborough: You know the superpower and kryptonite of every member of your family. You know your best friend. Think of the ramifications of understanding this on a human dynamic are phenomenal.

Kyle Davis: Mm-hmm (affirmative) So, when you know [00:25:00] your why and what you are. And how you kinda go through the world. Let's say I'm an innovator.

Ridgely Goldsborough: Mm-hmm (affirmative)

Kyle Davis: Aside from just kind of like what you just said, like the initial strengths and kind of kryptonite or weaknesses are. What other ancillary benefits can come of this? I mean, are we talking about the creation of better teams? Are we talking about the improvement of a recruiting process? [00:25:30] You know, I'm just trying to figure out different ways that you or people you've come in contact have iterated off of this.

Ridgely Goldsborough: All of the above and much, much more. So, let's start out with yourself.

Kyle Davis: Mm-hmm (affirmative)

Ridgely Goldsborough: You know how to play to your strength. You know that you, Kyle, cannot be put in a job that is nothing but routine, routine, routine. It would drive you up a tree. Would you agree?

Kyle Davis: Yes.

Ridgely Goldsborough: Right. So when you know that about yourself, you're not applying for that kind of job. You're not gonna join an organization [00:26:00] where they say, "Oh, by the way, you're the compliance person." Oh yeah, that'd be really good for Kyle to be the compliance person that had to review all the documents. And make sure they were always the same. They were always identical. It would drive you nuts.

Kyle Davis: Mm-hmm (affirmative)

Ridgely Goldsborough: So to know that about yourself says, "Okay, I, from this moment forward, am only gonna play to my strengths." Now, when you're looking for someone to fill a position. To know what is their strengths. And everybody wants to play to their strengths. So we talk about culture. A lot of times what I hear about a great culture [00:26:30] is, "I know it when I see it."

Kyle Davis: Mm-hmm (affirmative)

Ridgely Goldsborough: Well, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. Let's define that. What if everybody was playing to their strengths. Everybody understood each other. They got each other, because they knew, not the fact that they lived in a white-picket-fence house, and had a golden retriever and two kids, but they knew how they see the world through their avatar. They know what their strength is because of their superpower. They know where their challenge lies because of their kryptonite.

Suddenly, you're talking about a team that is relating on an entirely different level than the [00:27:00] average team. And that is how you can quantify the culture, you can say, "Wow, everybody gets each other. Everybody understands each other."

Clearly, this is a great tool for recruiting. Even better tool for creating a phenomenal team.

Kyle Davis: You just said an interesting phrase. Quantifying culture. The term culture has been really thrown around as like the cliché word of the time, when it comes to maybe HR or [00:27:30] how companies describe themselves, when it comes to recruiting. But when you're talking about quantifying culture, are you talking about, you know, here's the head of the organization and the people that this individual needs below them and beside them, have to fit these certain parameters. And you have to have these avatars. Are we talking about it like that? In like a binary sense? Or is it something more?

Ridgely Goldsborough: Well that's a great question. And, [00:28:00] somewhat yes. In other words, you for example as the innovator would not be well-suited for an accounting job. Right? It wouldn't work.

Kyle Davis: No. Math and I, we're not friends.

Ridgely Goldsborough: And neither is routine your friend. Whereas some people who really like routine, they love the thing of, "I got a checklist. I complete my checklist. I feel great about myself. I've done well by the organization. I'm in the right role for me."

And you've gotta have those kind of people in those right [00:28:30] roles. So yes it is that simplistic. Where it becomes a lot more interesting though is, imagine now that you have a real challenge. You're trying to come up with a new product. Who would you want on the team to think in an innovative way? You'd want Kyle Davis on that team. The innovator.

Kyle Davis: Mm-hmm (affirmative)

Ridgely Goldsborough: And then, well if we left Kyle by himself, he'd continue to innovate constantly. So, who else do you need? Oh, I need a problem solver, who's gonna make sure that the flow is in place. [00:29:00] And I want a perfectionist, who's gonna put a system in place. And then those three people together can come up with a great product.

Kyle Davis: Mm-hmm (affirmative)

Ridgely Goldsborough: Oh, and maybe I'm gonna get a connector to make sure there's a warm feeling around that. Suddenly, you could literally build a team to accomplish an objective based on making sure that you have a healthy dose of conflict with many sides exploring an issue.

As opposed to, "I like you because I am a lot like you. And therefore, I'm gonna invite you on my team. And we [00:29:30] together are gonna be the same. And we're not going to be able to accomplish anything new and creative."

Kyle Davis: Mm-hmm (affirmative) Yeah, I think that makes a lot of sense. I laughed because you said, "I know it when I see it." And I think for someone like myself maybe I feel like I have a very strong sense of intuition. And so, it's hard for me maybe to define what someone's avatar might be. But I know what benefits me. So, I'm going [00:30:00] back in my head of the people that I've hired and you know, I've had somebody who is like a devotee to the checklist manifesto.

Ridgely Goldsborough: Right.

Kyle Davis: Because that's not me. I mean, I get it and I understand it. And aww man, I support it. But, I can't live my life like that.

Ridgely Goldsborough: Right.

Kyle Davis: It's a bondage that I don't want to subject myself to.

Ridgely Goldsborough: Exactly right.

Kyle Davis: But yeah, I think it's great when you have something that's defined. It definitely puts a clearer lens [00:30:30] on what you're trying to find. And it helps with fit in an organization.

Ridgely Goldsborough: Well, and it creates a language.

Kyle Davis: Mm-hmm (affirmative)

Ridgely Goldsborough: So, literally on a team, in a dynamic, you're walking around the office and you're thinking, "I need this and such. Oh, who should I talk to? Oh, you know what? This is really an altruistic, value-creating space. Who are the givers on my team? Oh, let me go talk to Tina. Let me go talk to John. Okay, let's get those guys in a room real quick."

Kyle Davis: Mm-hmm (affirmative)

Ridgely Goldsborough: Oh, I need this other thing. We've [00:31:00] gotta have a new idea. Where's Kyle? Let me buy him lunch. It just gives you such power with the people that you're around. And, hey, think about how you feel on a limbic fashion, in that heart space, when I say to you, "Hey Kyle, man. I know you're so good at innovating and looking at things, and finding ways to improve these. I've got this thing that's been stumping me. Could you take a look at it for me?" How does that make you feel?

Kyle Davis: Mm-hmm (affirmative)

Ridgely Goldsborough: You're just lit up immediately. You're ready to go.

Kyle Davis: I'm stoked.

Ridgely Goldsborough: Right. Exactly. [00:31:30] So imagine that you knew the words to use to speak to anybody that would always get them that feeling of, "I'm stoked, you bet. I definitely love that, because you're asking me to play to my strengths. And that's exactly what I want to do." It's what everybody wants to do.

Kyle Davis: That is the gist of it, I guess.

Ridgely Goldsborough: Yeah. For sure. Who wants to play to their weakness? That's no fun.

Kyle Davis: No, man. Communicating with people? Nope. This is a dictatorship. I just want to tell you what to do.

Ridgely Goldsborough: And you know what? You're in charge of this podcast, you can do that.

Kyle Davis: [00:32:00] Yep. I'm like the nicest, benevolent dictator you've ever met.

Well, with that being said. I hereby pronounce that this podcast be over. But, if you would like to have Ridgely Goldsborough come and speak for you. You can do so by contacting GDA Speakers at 214-420-1999, or by going to GDASpeakers.com.

For the transcript, a selection of books, maybe all 15 of [00:32:30] them, and like I said, the transcript and photos and everything else, you can go to GDAPodcast.com.

Ridgely, thanks.

Ridgely Goldsborough: My pleasure, thank you.